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Old 9th Dec 2018, 9:31 PM #1001
Test Subject

Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 15

So, I'm trying this again, with a new computer. Same problem. I had to take out Pet Service just to get my family's lot to load. And I still get the problem where my sim can only do one action at a time when dealing with people, because clicking on them again to queue up a second action jump-bugs them right out of the current action. Also, "Force Error" does nothing on bugged objects, like the car that can only be driven ONCE before it gets stuck in "object in use" mode.

I'll see how long I can stand it. I might just have to learn the rules, and do it without the mods. But I want the one to protect the kids from being taken by Social Services, at least. We'll see how it goes.

I do love having the 64 squares of usable space per floor rule, because the roof will hold the military obstacle course reward! Yay!
Old 9th Dec 2018, 10:17 PM #1002
Test Subject

Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 15

Originally Posted by Sketching
I'm considering adding Laura's Out With the Bathwater mod and incorporating it into the Medicine career for clean water, but I still have to work out the kinks. Since they can only leave the lot once a week, they could pick up some water supplies along with the military rations*. Maybe they can get more water sources or invent more water collectors with Oceanography, Natural Science, or Science. Would they be able to carry that much water around? Hmm...

Oh, wow! I just checked that link, and OMG! I want to play medieval now! Hmmm, if I can't stand to do this tiered thing with the mods, then I'll use my "backup plan" sim (a sim who played through college with my founder), and send her to a MEDIEVAL APOCALYPSE! BWAAHAHAHAHAHAAAAA! And I'll totally tweak the rules, since I'll be doing it without those specific mods, so she can make the lifts in any order she likes, but she has to live medieval style. I figure I'd put down some rocks for her to collect water from the "snow", and if she digs for treasure, she can collect "ground water," near the rock. Yeah, that would work. I think I'd tweak the Athletic restrictions to allow for sims to carry buckets in their inventory. Maybe limit it to five items, instead of three, so they can carry sufficient buckets for a bath, and still hold a couple of other necessary items.

Golly, I'm already thinking of ways to kill off my official founder, so that I can do this. After all, I've completed the official, regular apocalypse a couple of times, sooo... Yeah. I think I will do that. Take out the mods (although they're wonderful for those who can get them to work right!), and use a tweaked version of the rules, for story-telling purposes. For example, I truly do believe that Athletic should be Tier 1. Really. How can you rebuild society, if you can't even build up your own body? How do you build strong buildings, if you can barely lift the bricks, let alone the beams? Tier 3 doesn't make sense to me.

Yep. I'm gonna do it. I love the rules, but Tier 1 is too small, and Athletic should not be in Tier 3, and I'll change the rule to carrying 5 items in the inventory for short periods of time. That is to say, you have 3 slots in your backpack, and two hands, so you can carry 5 buckets at once, but you have to put them down somewhere before you can do other things! That totally works, logically, right? IF you really want a bubble bath, you empty your inventory of other things, and fetch five buckets of water, and have your bath. Sponge bathing before that, of course. And besides, it's only day one, and I'm already sick of that glitch, that I have tried many times to remove, last year, and it's here AGAIN on a brand new computer! So, yeah. I'll use the rules, but manually, just like the original version. I'll have to refer to the rules ALL THE TIME, but I'm used to that.

Oh, can you wash dishes in these things? Or can I just declare that you used one to fill the special sink? I know! I'll place an object that looks like it can hold a store of water near the grill, so you heat it up for washing dishes. Put the sink near that, and you have one dish-washing sink. But still use the sponge-bathing from the bucket on a table. And with this, you can postpone Medicine for a generation or more. I think if children can sponge-bathe in a bucket, then I won't miss the mod preventing them from going to school. Hygiene is the biggest obstacle to passing school in this game. With an "armored school bus," they will be safe enough to go to a secure school, where they can learn their basic reading, writing, and 'rithmatic. Like in the original Pinstar rules, though, they would not get to go to high school, until Education is lifted, which means teens won't be able to have jobs, unless they start with A+ grades from elementary, and then get lucky with lots and lots and lots and lots of snow days (or else lots of Elixir of Life, drunk in the red).

Hmm, I'm thinking now, I'll have a mix of medieval and modern. The military hummer, no changes to defaults (I don't do default replacements, because I am not tech-savvy enough, anyway), but with the addition of these water-things (including that cistern/fridge! Awesome!). I even have only 63 used spaces on my ground floor, so I could put a rock just outside it, with a "dig for treasure" hole, and let my sims collect their ground-water there, and still keep my same basic building. I have a few spaces on the ground where I can put the grill, a bucket or rain barrel, and a sink, for washing dishes.

I'm gonna go check out that place, and see what other medieval-themed things I can put into my Medieval/Modern Tweaked-Tiers Apocalypse. I'll post links to AuthorStream, when I have stuff ready to go.

This is awesome! Thank you! You've inspired me to keep going, despite the glitches. Embrace the Manual, and do things manually!

Also, another tweak, is that I'm saying that the military ("We're under martial law, until the crisis is over, or at least eased up enough.") has declared that all families must attend the Headquarters (which I have set up as a combination Military, Medicine, and Culinary, and I'll add Athletic to it), once per week. To facilitate this, they will arrange escorts for each family, for their once-weekly visit. However, other than the once-weekly visit, no visits are allowed during Tier 1, and during Tier 2, everyone must have at least 7 body points for any un-escorted visits, until Law Enforcement is lifted, as the Police will then make sure the streets are safe for weaklings, as well as the strong.

Yaaaay! I'm excited!
Old 10th Dec 2018, 8:25 AM #1003

Join Date: Oct 2017
Posts: 933
1 Achievements

Hey, FlinkeMeisje! Glad to find another taker of the challenge here - I actually just finished the 12th rotation of my own tweaked challenge, though I've been slack on the updates. I was worried that it'd be against the rules to post about it here when it's been heavily modified, but then I read through the other threads and it seems to be fine to post about edited challenges, so maybe I should post about it here again.

To be fair, I like the tier system since it makes sense in the setting - it'd be rather inefficient to spend much needed resources on art when they barely have food. I did make several changes to the rules, and I agree about Athletic, especially since Military is in the first tier. I couldn't reconcile the thought of being able to attack zombies but unable to move a loveseat, and I thought that Science of all careers had several restrictions you can live without anyway, so I had to up the game to make it and a few of the other careers more important. The mod set caused a few problems in my game too, so I play without it and refer to the rules instead. I've been playing this challenge often enough that I nearly have most of the rules memorized anyway.

Another thing was that some of the restrictions didn't fit my setting. I imagined a ragtag bunch of survivors who worked together but not necessarily trusted each other, so I wanted a weekly mandatory community lot visit which was more like an examination of sorts, just like yours. Instead of further limiting community visits, I decided on rolling ROS weighted on skill points for them, though there's already a risk of community lot zombie attacks anyway. If they get into fights with other sims, there's a chance of death for the loser; if the fight was witnessed by playable friends or relatives, however, there's a probability of them retaliating as well.

I tweaked the original rules and weaved several of them into each other. Medical will allow access to water in limited doses and from limited sources, which can be increased through Natural Science, Oceanography, and Science. I use ACR to determine pregnancies for variety and randomness, and birth control will be introduced when (if?!) someone tops Medical. I grew tired of manually deducting my sims' funds during my previous runs, so I decided to just increase the bills and burglary rate, which works fine since I already normally play with halved EAxis wages.

The biggest rule change I created was allowing 3 founders from the get-go and allowing sims to start families despite not lifting a single career yet, mainly because I wanted a few more sims to play in the setting. You'd think it'd make the challenge a lot easier, but with all of the increased challenge mods and motivation levels affecting skilling, it's been a long 30 days without a single topped career. If I'm being realistic about my prospects, my military founder is likely to top the career, but the rest of Tier 1 will probably be on the second and/or third generation at this point. Just as well, since I added a rule about spares being sent to the military with death rolls for story purposes and her topping Military will mean decreased rates of draft and death.

I definitely agree with hygiene being a surprisingly difficult obstacle, especially for children. Out With the Bathwater is a semi-global makes all sinks/showers/baths require water, and though you can edit sinks to bypass the mod, I opted not to. The water's mainly for teen-adult sponge-bathing in my game for now, as sims can just throw their dishes into the trash can - you don't have to worry much about washing the dishes if you run out of water for that. With all of the motive-restricted items, even poor hygiene can cause sims to be passed over for promotion, prolonging the agony.

You can change babies' and toddlers' diapers to bring their hygiene up, but since Phaenoh's rules have it so that kids don't go to school until Education is unlocked, children spend nearly their entire childhood washing their hands at the sink and using up the household's water supply. It's funnier that kids and teens end up earning more useful skills when they stay at home instead of going to school, but children lose skilling time in favor of futilely trying to raise hygiene. I wish there was a mod to allow them to sponge-bathe too, though at least they can bathe at the medical facility and have time to catch up on skills when they age up into teens.

I'm confused about your statement regarding teen jobs - if I remember correctly, Phaenoh's rules have it so that teens can get non-military teen jobs as long it's one in which one of their parents is employed. This works out a bit since if said parent is still a living adult (or is elder fine?) by the time the teen ages up into an adult themselves, they can remain with the career level they jump into instead of starting again from Level 1.

I have a link in my signature for increased challenge mods if you want to increase chances of death. I recently added in an edited version of Cyjon's Ghost Hack. I didn't think I'd have a need for it just yet, but a founder's spouse died in a fire and now seems keen on taking everyone else with him! His former wife recently just got remarried after almost losing two best friends to her first husband's ghost, and needless to say, it's been a struggle keeping them alive. I'd say it's even deadlier than the actual zombies and ROS deaths - if it keeps up, the later generations might be in for a rougher ride even if other restrictions are lifted.

Now you've got me thinking about an actual medieval zombie apocalypse - that sounds even harder than a modern one for some reason. Have fun at PBK - they have loads of amazing stuff there too.

Eh, I don't know if anyone's interested, but I posted about the set-up here and I'll plop some random pictures here anyway.
Last edited by Sketching : 10th Dec 2018 at 2:09 PM. Reason: pictures

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