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Old 2nd Sep 2016, 1:36 AM #51
PANDAQUEEN
Theorist

Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 2,503


Only out of desperation.

Among Hindu belief, milk is fine, but not beef.
Among Jewish and Muslim belief, pigs are filthy for rolling in filth.
Among my parents, we eat chicken in spite of them scratching in their own filth.

There will be a time of desperation and it may be a time to trade your morals for convenience.

http://richinc.boards.net <--- My forum. Currently has a general talk board and a cooking board. Check back for more boards... please don't hurt me.
Old 12th Sep 2016, 3:20 AM #52
XxCTxX
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Generally speaking, I'd say no as we have been "conditioned" to see cats and dogs as household pets.

If it was desperate times.. Well usually that calls for desperate measures and no one really knows until they are in that situation.

Tbh, I generally don't eat any meat or fish. They are yummy but it makes me sad that something cute has been killed.
Old 29th Jan 2017, 10:06 PM #53
ShanghaiShark
Test Subject

Join Date: Jan 2017
Posts: 7


Luckily I'm vegetarian, so no, I don't eat cats or dogs and am not planning on doing so.
Old 7th Feb 2017, 11:59 PM #54
mixa97sr
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I saw the post and, I've thought about this, but only for short instances of time. Now that I saw this, and crowkeeper's post, I can surelly say that that's the only reason why it's more acceptable to eat livestock meat than a dog/cat meat. And also men should find dogs and cats more valuable in other regard (like hunt, or pest control).

I actually find it a bit cruel to kill animals, as I was always sure they deffinitely have some kind of conciousness (not as developed as human, but still), and that they also have emotions. Yeah, I'm 100% sure animals have emotions, even though scientist find it debatable (only to be able to justify animal killing).

My grandma had a sheep and a lamb on her farm. This summer I was in visit, and at first, those two were afraid, a bit agressive too, mother was protecting her child after all. After a month spent together, those two started getting used to my company. Eventually they even took food from my hand. Then they started begging for food and even jumped around like crazy whenever they saw me or my mother aproaching. I once even saw the lamb climb onto it's mother. They still did not like stroking though... but it was a great month spent with those two.

Then the mother sheep died, and everybody was sad. Little lamb was left alone. At first it seemed like it did not notice that her mother was gone, but after a week it started sulking, and we had to make it eat. It did not want to get out of it house, it did not want to walk often, we had to keep her alive. After some time she started eating properly again, and she would also come to us for comfort. She even allowed us to pet her. So another month passed, and it looked like the lamb got over it. She was also starting to look like a grown sheep herself. I remember when my family was leaving the farm, when we were going back home it saluted us with a loud "BAAAA" and ran across the yard just to say goodbye.

15 days ago I hear it's been killed for meat, as my uncle had no interest in keeping her alive from the beginning. I was a bit sad, but my understanding of the situation did not allow me to cry. My sister on the other hand, she was a mess that day.

I don't really find the act of taking away life of any form majestic or grand but seeing it as nececarry I do find it reasonable and acceptable.

The western culture developed certain viewpoint that cats and dogs should have a different use and not that of a food, while much larger animals are far more valuable in that regard. Eastern cultures (China) though, have their viewpoints on that matter that also developed long time ago. I don't really blame them, all of the cultures are different in lot of ways, and eating of cats and dogs is their developed custom. But I still find it strange, growing up under the western culture influence and because of that not being able to understand the eastern viewpoint.

I am against globalization, it has it's own good points, but it is far more hectic and unable to control than anybody else thinks. Still, seeing some weird and, from my side, unacceptable customs over different cultures makes me question the need for maintaining the integrity of the nationality, especially when the most of such culture is based on violence and exploit... Though, what am I talking about? The "civilization" is the prime example of those traits.

I went further and jumped across the topic of this thread... I always do such thing when debating. When it comes to this, I think it should be individual. You can't place the sticker of your opinion over the whole humanity. If certain people prefer dog and cat meat over other, why not... Yours is to judge them, but accept the fact that it's how that person is. What would happen if there was a law across the world that prohibits the dog meat? Would it stop it's exploit... I don't think so. We have a whole nation, that contains one third of our species, develop a specific taste for dog meat over the course of history. I don't really see how can that be surpressed now and how can one tiny opinion, or any opinion, change that.
Old 8th Feb 2017, 1:29 AM #55
EvilMcNastySim2015
Instructor

Join Date: Apr 2015
Posts: 558


Yay! that is all.

My PC specs.
Windows 7 64 bit,AMD FX 4300 quad core processor, 8 gigs DDR3 ram, 1 gig Geforce 9500 graphics card, patch 1.67.2
Every time I reinstall the game I run it clean without any CC, not even the store bought stuff so it isn't CC or mods that cause me trouble.
Old 28th Feb 2017, 12:35 AM #56
SuicidiaParasidia
Alchemist

Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 2,955


Quote:
Originally Posted by Crowkeeper
Maybe plants do feel pain and maybe they dont but that doesn't mean that being killed (cutted, picked) isn't a terrible experience for them.


INTERESTINGLY.... (To add to your point)
http://relaximanentomologist.tumblr...sects-feel-pain
TLDR, insects do feel pain...but not the same way we do. They understand that they are being damaged, but they don't have an emotional response to pain that humans and many higher evolved species.
Your cat, for example, can feel fear along with pain. So can your dog. So can many others. https://academic.oup.com/bioscience...ring-Passionate

So almost certainly, plants do feel pain, but not in the emotional sense that we do. However, cats and dogs....definitely respond to pain with emotion, same as us.
However, it's also a luxury to be able to see animals as friends rather than food. I think first world countries tend to forget that, and take what systems they have, for granted. In a lot of the countries that do eat cats and dogs, there aren't many other sources of food, and cats and dogs are plentiful because none of them are neutered or spayed. It only makes sense in such places to eat the most plentiful source of food available, and it's very easy to preach to those countries from atop a pedestal crafted of alternative foods.

@mixa97sr: No, scientists do not "find it debatable (only to be able to justify animal killing)". Science is concerned with evidence, and more and more scientific studies ARE finding evidence that animals feel pain. And no, science doesn't have an agenda, unless you count "clarifying the world we live in to other humans" as an agenda. Dogs and cats have scientific backing to support the hypothesis that they experience things like happiness, sadness, fear, depression, and apprehension. My personal thoughts on this is that that's a large part in why we're able to form connections with them so easily: We understand their emotions on a visceral level.
But, again. I don't live in a country that needs to eat cats or dogs to survive. We really don't need to eat a lot of animals to survive, really, and we're getting much better at humane killing (Which, as oxymoronic as it may seem, does involve not subjecting the animal to unnecessary stressors before it's killed....death may be necessary, but it doesn't need to be cruel).

"The more you know, the sadder you get."~ Stephen Colbert
"Science literacy is a vaccine against the charlatans of the world that would exploit your ignorance."~ Neil DeGrasse Tyson
"I'm not going to censor myself to comfort your ignorance." ~ Jon Stewart
Old 10th Apr 2017, 1:45 PM #57
CalebFillion
Test Subject

Join Date: Mar 2017
Posts: 8


In our western world of course we say no. We tend to eat smarter animals like horses and pigs. Or gentler animals like cows. Or lambs that come for cuddles. I do not object to what anyone eats, I object to how they go about it. In no way does an animal need to suffer or be afraid that is purely barbarism and a power play. Those people in China need to be whipped, skinned and roasted. Nuff said.
Old 10th May 2017, 9:00 AM #58
KayeStar
Test Subject

Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 48



"The call isn't out there at all! It's inside me!" - Moana
Old 10th Oct 2017, 2:09 AM #59
ikabarrplaysims
Test Subject

Join Date: Oct 2017
Posts: 9


I vote Yay, and first off, I would NOT eat a cat nor dog, but I agree with people who do: it's their stomach. We are also in a way animals and need to eat. It'll just be another form of meat. I just wouldn't eat it, personally, it's on what people want. For flying craps, people even breed cockroaches for consumption! And that's just fine. They do they.
Old 11th Nov 2017, 4:56 AM #60
Kunder
Lab Assistant

Join Date: Apr 2015
Posts: 203


Cats + Dogs = Self-propelled food rations.

Horses, Cicadas fresh out of the shell, wasp larvae, white grubs, toe biters, aquatic insect larvae, deer, hogs, 'Dillo's, 'Yotes, and just about anything else that moves, flies, or swims, is fair game.
If it exists the U.S, chances are, I've most likely eaten it.
Old 11th Nov 2017, 6:29 AM #61
Kunder
Lab Assistant

Join Date: Apr 2015
Posts: 203


Quote:
Originally Posted by tsyokawe
@Crowkeeper

Me too. I'm not going to let myself starve. I continue to eat meat, too.
I do try to only eat meat from local people, people whom I trust to treat animals kindly.
And when it gets down to it, most of my meat is trout, elk, deer, buffalo, and local chickens.

When I've harvest plants, I've offered tobacco with a prayer of thanks.
I don't know that it makes the plants feel any better, but it stills my grief some.
And I do believe that we are all interconnected. So, just because I cannot
speak whatever language the plant's spirit might, I'm hoping that they
understand that the tobacco has meaning.
I thank God for my food. I pick Amaranth, Stinging nettles, Bamboo shoots, etc. Clean them, and unceremoniously, toss them in a pot with chicken stock (juice from a mechanically separated, and squeezed chicken), onions, butter, salt and pepper. Cook til tender, then eat.

When I hunt, a single shot to the head, is the most humane way to dispatch prey. Deer, hogs, any other medium sized mammalian prey, is cured for five days (10 days in winter, if the temp doesn't rise above 40 degrees Fahrenheit). Small game, like 'Dillo's, ground hogs, marmots, turtles, or Nutria, are eaten pretty soon after killing. Fish are always eaten immediately.

Yes.... I EAT BUGS.

I hunt with bow, AR-15, SKS, or anything I may have at hand at that time.

When I moved to Texas, for the first six months, I fed 3 teenagers, and 3 adults, every day, on what I hunted, or foraged from the woods. NO one went hungry... EVER.
Money we had, went to cat and dog food, milk (I made my OWN butter), flour, molasses, REAL maple syrup and sweet potatoes. That's what I made my bread from. I would (and still do) process acorns, cattail flour, and amaranth seeds for bread also. My eggs were from a local lake. I gathered duck and goose eggs. I fished with hand lines, and gorge hooks made from bone, or mesquite thorns. I made my own fishing line from Yucca leaves. Bow strings from deer intestines, etc.

I did this, so my family didn't go hungry, and I didn't need any "public assistance" either. I did all this in an unceremonious, humane as possible, and frank manner.

It's there, I'm hungry, I kill, or forage it, I eat it. Simple as that.

Disagree if you like. It's called survival.
Last edited by Kunder : 13th Nov 2017 at 5:52 AM.
Old 13th Nov 2017, 5:50 AM
Kunder
This message has been deleted by Kunder. Reason: please
Old 19th Nov 2017, 4:23 PM #62
SuicidiaParasidia
Alchemist

Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 2,955


I visit this bizarre and niche thing mostly known as a "gross-er-ee sto-rh", so I've never gone hungry, either. Rumor has it that vegetables and fruit are in there. I've heard that Texas has them, too.

"The more you know, the sadder you get."~ Stephen Colbert
"Science literacy is a vaccine against the charlatans of the world that would exploit your ignorance."~ Neil DeGrasse Tyson
"I'm not going to censor myself to comfort your ignorance." ~ Jon Stewart
Old 22nd Nov 2017, 1:01 AM
Shoosh Malooka
This message has been deleted by Shoosh Malooka.
Old 26th Nov 2017, 10:38 PM #63
Kunder
Lab Assistant

Join Date: Apr 2015
Posts: 203


Quote:
Originally Posted by SuicidiaParasidia
I visit this bizarre and niche thing mostly known as a "gross-er-ee sto-rh", so I've never gone hungry, either. Rumor has it that vegetables and fruit are in there. I've heard that Texas has them, too.
Ok, what would you do if you suddenly found yourself without a home, or any income whatsoever, no one but yourself to lean on, and you have kids to feed? This DOES happen. I've seen it. Despite the sarcasm, YOU could find yourself in that spot.

I used to teach outdoor survival to the Military. I did this for a living for 25 years, working for the DoD. I grew up on a farm. My Dad is full blooded Iroquois, He insisted that I be self sufficient, and wanted me to keep "Native" American traditions alive, and pass them down to my kids. Yes, there are grocery stores here. The meat isn't that great, I prefer FRESH meat and fish, with no additives. I'm not fond of "garden variety" vegetables, I prefer the wild ones. I preserve meat, and vegetables the same way my ancestors did. I'm a member of the Seneca Brotherhood, and try and live as close to the land as possible, just as my ancestors did.

County ordinance says that I MUST have running water, electricity, and and adequate sewage system, and I'm fine with that. However, I'm perfectly capable of living comfortably without any of that if I had to. I've done it before.

I also have the satisfaction of knowing that I need NO one to survive, and feed me, and my family. If things went badly in this country, I'd barely notice. My paternal Great Grandmother lived through the depression. She told me that she never even noticed it.

If we went through that again, I'D never notice it.

So, before you respond back to this, consider that there are people with different lifestyles than yours. Some by choice, some by necessity. I CHOOSE to live like I do, as I don't much care for the "Rat Race", and wish to enjoy life on my own, simple terms.
Last edited by Kunder : 26th Nov 2017 at 10:59 PM.
Old 1st Dec 2017, 5:31 AM #64
SuicidiaParasidia
Alchemist

Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 2,955


Quote:
Originally Posted by Kunder
Ok, what would you do if you suddenly found yourself without a home, or any income whatsoever, no one but yourself to lean on, and you have kids to feed? This DOES happen. I've seen it. Despite the sarcasm, YOU could find yourself in that spot.


Actually, I couldn't find myself in that spot, for a variety of personal reasons that I'm not going to discuss here. But I get your point.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kunder
I used to teach outdoor survival to the Military. I did this for a living for 25 years, working for the DoD. I grew up on a farm. My Dad is full blooded Iroquois, He insisted that I be self sufficient, and wanted me to keep "Native" American traditions alive, and pass them down to my kids. Yes, there are grocery stores here. The meat isn't that great, I prefer FRESH meat and fish, with no additives. I'm not fond of "garden variety" vegetables, I prefer the wild ones. I preserve meat, and vegetables the same way my ancestors did. I'm a member of the Seneca Brotherhood, and try and live as close to the land as possible, just as my ancestors did.


Okay.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kunder
County ordinance says that I MUST have running water, electricity, and and adequate sewage system, and I'm fine with that. However, I'm perfectly capable of living comfortably without any of that if I had to. I've done it before.

I also have the satisfaction of knowing that I need NO one to survive, and feed me, and my family. If things went badly in this country, I'd barely notice. My paternal Great Grandmother lived through the depression. She told me that she never even noticed it.

If we went through that again, I'D never notice it.

So, before you respond back to this, consider that there are people with different lifestyles than yours. Some by choice, some by necessity. I CHOOSE to live like I do, as I don't much care for the "Rat Race", and wish to enjoy life on my own, simple terms.


If things went badly enough, not even you would be safe from it. Climate change would--and does--affect everybody's way of life...but more severely than ever, if it got worse. There's no such thing as complete security....that's your point, right?
In the mean time, many of us are content with our choices as well. Despite all your talk about natural living, I can't help but notice you're posting it on the internet.

"The more you know, the sadder you get."~ Stephen Colbert
"Science literacy is a vaccine against the charlatans of the world that would exploit your ignorance."~ Neil DeGrasse Tyson
"I'm not going to censor myself to comfort your ignorance." ~ Jon Stewart
Old 1st Dec 2017, 10:37 AM #65
simbalena
Top Secret Researcher

Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 1,960


Quote:
Originally Posted by CalebFillion
In our western world of course we say no. We tend to eat smarter animals like horses and pigs.


What "western world" do you come from? No one eats horses in my "western world".

I wouldn't put a lot of effort into getting it transported.
Old 2nd Dec 2017, 9:44 PM #66
310175
Inventor

Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 897


I've had horse. There used to be a horse butcher near my hometown in Germany. It's a bit like deer.
Old 4th Dec 2017, 4:31 PM #67
Kunder
Lab Assistant

Join Date: Apr 2015
Posts: 203


Quote:
Originally Posted by SuicidiaParasidia
Actually, I couldn't find myself in that spot, for a variety of personal reasons that I'm not going to discuss here. But I get your point.



Okay.



If things went badly enough, not even you would be safe from it. Climate change would--and does--affect everybody's way of life...but more severely than ever, if it got worse. There's no such thing as complete security....that's your point, right?
In the mean time, many of us are content with our choices as well. Despite all your talk about natural living, I can't help but notice you're posting it on the internet.


Partially true.
No one is ever completely safe, including myself/yourself. However, I stand a much better chance, for far longer than most. Climate change isn't a problem. More CO2, more plant and animal life, longer growing seasons, etc. I would worry if it were getting colder. Nothing you can do about climate change. It's a natural cycle. Adapt, overcome, improvise, or die. Simple as that.

I'm not going to judge anyone on the way they live, as long as it doesn't affect me, and my family. I'm not begrudging the use of modern technology, or equipment for anyone.

You wouldn't help to notice that I also, drive a car that gets 6mpg/freeway, and another one that gets 40mpg. I'm required to have electricity, although, I'm hoping to go solar here sometime in the future.
I also build, and refurbish computers. I also hunt with a modern AR15. I also use a chainsaw...... As I said, Improvise, Adapt, overcome. Nothing wrong with using modern equipment, it's when you rely on it to the point that it rules you, and you can't do without it. That's asking for trouble. Just an example: I don't NEED an AR15 to hunt with. I can do that with a bow, atlatl, or a spear. I can also trap. However, the AR makes food gathering MUCH easier. I do not hunt for sport at all, I hunt to eat. I don't NEED a chainsaw, but it certainly makes cutting wood a lot easier! I don't NEED to work, go to a grocery store, or drive a car, but it sure makes life easier . I don't NEED indoor plumbing, I live by a large creek, and a lake. I know how to sterilize my water, and I know how to build a proper latrine. I don't NEED electricity, I know how to preserve food the old way. However, it certainly makes life a lot easier!

I've lived without electricity, plumbing, or indoor running water, I can do it again, if need be.

"I couldn't find myself in that spot, for a variety of personal reasons that I'm not going to discuss here." NEVER say never!!! No offense meant, but You're kidding yourself.
Last edited by Kunder : 4th Dec 2017 at 4:54 PM.
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