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Old 25th Dec 2018, 1:17 AM #26
simmer22
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I don't think an outright ban is the way to go, but putting restrictions on how/where to buy it, age restrictions, and where you're allowed to smoke may be the way to go.

The thing with smoking is that it doesn't just destroy your own health, but it also messes with the health of the people around you. People with allergies, children, animals, and basically everyone around you has an increased risk of getting health issues when you smoke around them. The there-and-then risk may be small for most people (unless they have lung issues or allergies), but added up over several months/years (for instance parents smoking indoors) smoking can lead to a boatload of health issues.

I don't mind when people do stupid things to themselves as long as it only affects their own health - but when other people are affected by their choices, it becomes a problem.

Where I live, smoking is not banned, but where you can smoke is restricted (outside but not too close to public entrances and not in all public areas, in your own home, and in occasional designated public areas in restaurants and such - usually not indoors), and tobacco products are quite expensive. The popularity of smoking has gone down in the younger population, so with a bit of luck there will eventually be a lot fewer smokers.

Personally I'd love to see all tobacco products vanish off the face of Earth. I'm not allergic, but the smoke and smell really bothers me to the point where I almost feel I can't breathe, so I feel with those who have actual health issues that gets worse with passive smoking. Speaking from the standpoint of healthcare personnel, it would probably make our job quite a bit easier if all tobacco-realted health issues vanished along with the tobacco (that goes for illegal narcotics as well, though some of the legal but restricted variants like prescription opioids for pain relief and similar might still be needed - but maybe we should be more careful in their use of these, as chronic pain combined with prolonged opioid use is one of the causes people start using heavier drugs and/or get serious drug-related issues).
Last edited by simmer22 : 25th Dec 2018 at 1:27 AM.
Old 25th Dec 2018, 12:45 PM #27
sailorplanet97
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Quote:
Originally Posted by simmer22
I don't think an outright ban is the way to go, but putting restrictions on how/where to buy it, age restrictions, and where you're allowed to smoke may be the way to go.

The thing with smoking is that it doesn't just destroy your own health, but it also messes with the health of the people around you. People with allergies, children, animals, and basically everyone around you has an increased risk of getting health issues when you smoke around them. The there-and-then risk may be small for most people (unless they have lung issues or allergies), but added up over several months/years (for instance parents smoking indoors) smoking can lead to a boatload of health issues.

I don't mind when people do stupid things to themselves as long as it only affects their own health - but when other people are affected by their choices, it becomes a problem.

Where I live, smoking is not banned, but where you can smoke is restricted (outside but not too close to public entrances and not in all public areas, in your own home, and in occasional designated public areas in restaurants and such - usually not indoors), and tobacco products are quite expensive. The popularity of smoking has gone down in the younger population, so with a bit of luck there will eventually be a lot fewer smokers.

Personally I'd love to see all tobacco products vanish off the face of Earth. I'm not allergic, but the smoke and smell really bothers me to the point where I almost feel I can't breathe, so I feel with those who have actual health issues that gets worse with passive smoking. Speaking from the standpoint of healthcare personnel, it would probably make our job quite a bit easier if all tobacco-realted health issues vanished along with the tobacco (that goes for illegal narcotics as well, though some of the legal but restricted variants like prescription opioids for pain relief and similar might still be needed - but maybe we should be more careful in their use of these, as chronic pain combined with prolonged opioid use is one of the causes people start using heavier drugs and/or get serious drug-related issues).



omg i totally forgot about this one, haha

i totally forgot it could destroy other people (and animals) aswell too, i guess i was busy typing all of this that i totally forgot it could also destroy other people's (and animals) body (that won't do smoking) too, thanks for the reminding

i remember from years ago that i was on visite and a few people started to smoke, i couldn't stand the smoke, not just the bad smell but also when the smoke came to my eyes,
i got tears when the smoke was on my eyes
Old 25th Dec 2018, 1:34 PM #28
simmer22
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^ Not sure if you're joking or if you actually do find it funny, but for most people who do react to tobacco smoke it's no joke. For kids who end up with asthma or allergies because their parents smoke, it's also no joke. Smoking/tobacco/drugs can even be a danger to kids before they're born, if their mother use any of it while pregnant.

Where I currently work smoking isn't allowed indoors (patients, visitors, workers, and whomever else smokes have to go outside), but while I had nursing practice in home care, I got first-hand experience with how bad the work environment can get. We had at least a couple of patients who smoked so much their entire living room would look like several smoke bombs had gone off in there. Since it was their home, we couldn't do anything about it, and the rules about work environment and air quality that affects other work enviromnments (hospitals, institutions, etc.) didn't have any effect whatsoever. I did like most aspects of working in home care, but things like this made me reconsider that particular line of work. This, and other potentially hazardous home environments (of which there are plenty).

My personal philosophy (has so far mostly worked for me, but I can't guarantee the effect for anyone else) is that if you don't want to have to quit an addicting and/or bad habit at some point, don't start it in the first place.

Information does help, but it's less effective for those who already smoke than for younger generations who haven't tried it yet. The older you are, the longer you've smoked, and the more into the bad habit you are, the less likely you'll be able to quit. They know it's dagerous to their health, but they either like the bad habit or find it very hard to quit.
Last edited by simmer22 : 25th Dec 2018 at 2:07 PM.
Old 26th Dec 2018, 10:53 PM #29
sailorplanet97
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i didn't found it funny and neither am i making jokes

i'm just laughing at myself for forgetting to type anything about how it destroys other people aswell too who don't do the smoking.
i can't stand the smell of the smokes (i don't do the smoking)

i was busy typing about how bad smoke is for your body when you do smoking that i totally forget that it's bad for other people too but also animals,

i might be dumb by not typing this part but i'm NOT that stupid though

and even though it might not sounded like that, it was a "thanks for the reminding" thing i wasn't trying to be rude or anything like that.
and at work (it depends on where your working at) it isn't allowed to smoke, unless when there's a smoking place where only smoke people are allowed to use it (outside)

i do know all of it from above that it could be dangerous for the mother and the baby using drugs, alcohol and smoke, i learned it once at school.

i also know it isn't easy to quit smoking, my parents, aunts and one of my parents friends used to smoke (i only remember the smoking part from my mom and one of my parents best friends)
most of them stopped smoking, one of my parents best friend died of cancer (probably the combination with drinking alcohol and smoking) and one of my other parents best friend has an heart-attack (that person survived it though) so he decided to stop smoking after that incident almost 2 years ago.

you've got a point at the end though, there might still be a couple of people who found it hard to quit smoking or doesn't even care it's dangerous to their body
Old 26th Dec 2018, 11:19 PM #30
joandsarah77
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@sailorplanet97 It was the laughing smilies paired with the text that gives the impression of joking or sarcasm since that's all people have to go on when they can't see or hear you. If you are being serious its best to leave out all laughing emoji's.

Reminds me the other day I was watching an American show on Youtube and this add came on and I had to call my kids over to come and watch it as I was so astonished. We were somewhere between laughing and horrified. It was some kind of quit smoking product and the guy is so happy and hamming up how great it is then it switches to say all the things it can cause including horrible allergies, seizures, suicidal thoughts and death! O_O The add came across almost like a skit to us, like who on earth would use a product with those side effects, but I know it was a serious advertisement. I found it! https://www.ispot.tv/ad/wd1Z/chantix-ryan

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Old 27th Dec 2018, 8:27 AM #31
Gargoyle Cat
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joandsarah77
Reminds me the other day I was watching an American show on Youtube and this add came on and I had to call my kids over to come and watch it as I was so astonished. We were somewhere between laughing and horrified. It was some kind of quit smoking product and the guy is so happy and hamming up how great it is then it switches to say all the things it can cause including horrible allergies, seizures, suicidal thoughts and death! O_O The add came across almost like a skit to us, like who on earth would use a product with those side effects, but I know it was a serious advertisement. I found it! https://www.ispot.tv/ad/wd1Z/chantix-ryan


This can be seen for almost any drug sold in the US; the side effects are often worse than the problem itself / causes more serious problems than the actual diagnosis. A example although not related to smoking, but a drug that I'm often put on due to being a asthmatic.

Prednisone

This same drug killed my cat; he died of heart failure. He was put on Prednisone via my vet for a skin condition. Even though he was seen every year for a physical, between his yearly physicals he developed a heart problem that nobody knew about and went undetected ( my vet didn't hear it) when he was given the meds. My vet always does a routine physical before putting any animal on medication.

You can't throw a rock in this country without seeing some ad about how [insert drug name here] will do some magical thing and cure people of whatever their condition is, but then there is the side effects list that they are legally bound to get through as fast as humanly possible. It is even more interesting coming across these ads in magazines. The list of side effects in some cases start on one page and take up a whole second page.

There is something ( many things, actually) to be said about Big Pharma, this however isn't the thread for it. None of it is nice, at least not from where I'm sitting. RIP, Mojo. I miss ya, buddy.

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Old 27th Dec 2018, 1:42 PM #32
simmer22
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Here you can't advertise for most types of pharmacy medications in public media (but for a few exceptions), but it seems "food supplements" can make as many ads as they like. "This garlic product made all my arthritis problems go away" and "because of this blueberry product I can see better!" and the like - but I always go to the ingredient list if there is one. Blueberries, garlic, ginseng and whatnot may have some health benefits, but they aren't miracle foods that will cure anything. Some "miracle products" may even be dangerous, as seen with several examples where some people with serious conditions switch out actual medications for various snake oils, and die as a result. It's the same with "miracle diets". While some of them do have actual health benefits, most of the ones that seem too good to be true do have the "oh by the way, remember to eat less and exercise more" hidden deep within the article. If you eat this nutri bar in addition to everything else, you'll gain weight. If you only eat this nutri bar (and exercise more), you may lose some weight. Even smoking was once used as a method of dieting (quitting smoking can cause weight gain, though possibly because the appetite returns).

Most of the more scary side effects for the everyday pharmacy drugs are uncommon or rare. If you look it up, you'll usually see that some side effects are listed as common, perhaps 1 in 10 gets them - most of these are more annoying than dangerous, for instance stomach issues, redness, and the like. Some side effects are less common (maybe allergic reactions and the like), while the ones involving seizures or death are usually in the rare category, where 1-2 out of maybe a hundred thousand or so may have had a seizure or died because they took that particular medication. It's basically the company behind the medication covering their ass, and has to do with the reporting back from doctors, patients and various drug studies, because they're legally bound to list any and all known side effects. The likeliness of getting side effects may also have to do with the quantity used and over which timeframe (one pill once in a while or the highest dose every day for 10 years), and the tolerance of the person taking the drugs (allergies, age, weight, pre-existing conditions, interactions with other drugs, etc.).

Pretty much everything you put in your body may have side effects, particularly in too large quantities. Even essentials like water and oxygen can be toxic or otherwise dangerous under the wrong circumstances.

The thing with smoking is that there are pretty much only health risks involved (the few, if any, benefits are obtainable in other and healthier ways), so you'll be better off not smoking.

sailorplanet97, like Jo said, it's best to cut the laughing smilies if you're trying to appear serious. Otherwise people may get the wrong impression.

Hmm... I think we got over to a side track again.
Last edited by simmer22 : 27th Dec 2018 at 1:58 PM.
Old 28th Dec 2018, 6:53 PM #33
SuicidiaParasidia
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My only problem with smokers/smoking is that it's airborne. When I drink my alcoholic beverages, I'm not forcing everyone around me to drink (I'm also doing it at home). When a smoker lights up around me, they ARE forcing me to inhale smoke as well.
Just as drinking in public is illegal (As far as where I live), I would be for smoking in public to be illegal as well. Aside from the rancid stench, it has very real impacts on the health of your lungs, and unlike earlobes or middle fingers or hair, I need those to survive. They're already taking enough of a hit from pollutants beyond anyone's personal control.... smoking, however, is not beyond personal control.
I get that it's about stress relief, but again, it becomes a public matter when it impacts people who aren't you. Chewing tobacco might be a better choice, provided the person chewing it won't spit everywhere like a pig.
Being concerned for your health is your job, much the same as being concerned for my health is my job: I won't tell you not to smoke. I will however, tell you not to smoke around me, as what goes into my body is my choice the same way what goes into your body is your choice.



By the way, sincerely doubt you'd be in favor of "rational" human behavior favoring personal enjoyment that came at a cost to you. If every time I drank around you, you lost a couple layers of skin on your hands, I doubt you'd be so nonchalant about it, @HarVee. You don't have to be besties with a person to be considerate towards them, and most people understand that there are certain public etiquettes that keep communal zones harmonious. Your home is not a communal zone: Smoke there.

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Last edited by SuicidiaParasidia : 28th Dec 2018 at 7:04 PM.
Old 28th Dec 2018, 11:49 PM #34
Gargoyle Cat
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I wish people that drank kept it to themselves, but they don't. Two dear friends of mine were killed by a drunk driver. I told them I loved them one day, they were gone the following day. The drunk lost his license for a year, whoop-dee-do.

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Old 29th Dec 2018, 1:59 AM #35
simmer22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SuicidiaParasidia
Chewing tobacco might be a better choice, provided the person chewing it won't spit everywhere like a pig.


Marginally better, since it mostly just damages their own health, but it's gross and makes a lot of mess if people don't dispose of it properly.

Here they sell scruff (I think it's the same as chewing tobacco) in little portion bags for putting under the lips. While I was a student I lived together with at least one scruff user who didn't seem to know what a garbage bin was. I found those little used bags all over the house, particularly in the bathroom - in the soap cups in the shower, in the toilet because he was apparently unable to flush, on the sink because who knows why, but rarely if ever in the garbage bin.

But a lot of smokers are also pigs, and apparently there's no such thing as a cigarette tray. There's stumps all over the city, particularly in bus shelters and around entryways. It's disgusting.

Then again, there's also downtrodden pieces of chewing gum all over, and pieces of garbage everywhere but the bins, so not only the nicotine slaves are messy. They do contribute to quite a lot of the mess, though.

It really bothers me when people insist on smoking around entryways, on sidewalks, in bus shelters, or in other public places where you don't have a lot of choice but to go through or stand in the clouds of smoke. I wish they could do it elsewhere, where they're less of a nuisance. Also doesn't hurt to walk a few meters downwind... And if it's raining, your cloud of smoke can stay way outside the bus shelter, thank you very much. If you want to stay dry, stump it. No need to bother everyone else in the bus shelter or entryway with your disgusting habit.

I don't mind if someone decides they want to smoke and ruin their health. Their choice, that's fine. What I DO mind is when they decide to do it next to me, next to other people who don't like the smoke, next to kids, while pregnant, or in any other way so that it is potentially harmful for another person, in the short or long term. But ouside, alone, in the rain? Sure.
Last edited by simmer22 : 29th Dec 2018 at 2:14 AM.
Old 29th Dec 2018, 5:27 AM #36
HarVee
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SuicidiaParasidia
as what goes into my body is my choice the same way what goes into your body is your choice.

So do you have a choice over if you breathe oxygen or not?

"Towards the end of any culture, you have the second or third generation that steps into the culture, which is so far from the origination, it's the impression of what's real, but it's not the full definition of what's real. It's just cheesy." - Lyle Owerko
Old 29th Dec 2018, 1:15 PM #37
simmer22
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^ I'd like to have a choice in regards to breathing in oxygen with or without a large cloud of cigarette smoke. There's more than enough pollution going around already.

If you want to smoke, it's your choice. But you don't need to do it around people who don't want to inhale the smoke, particularly in areas where it's difficult to get away from the smoke.
Old 29th Dec 2018, 11:28 PM #38
joandsarah77
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Quote:
Originally Posted by simmer22
Marginally better, since it mostly just damages their own health, but it's gross and makes a lot of mess if people don't dispose of it properly.

Here they sell scruff (I think it's the same as chewing tobacco) in little portion bags for putting under the lips. While I was a student I lived together with at least one scruff user who didn't seem to know what a garbage bin was. I found those little used bags all over the house, particularly in the bathroom - in the soap cups in the shower, in the toilet because he was apparently unable to flush, on the sink because who knows why, but rarely if ever in the garbage bin.

But a lot of smokers are also pigs, and apparently there's no such thing as a cigarette tray. There's stumps all over the city, particularly in bus shelters and around entryways. It's disgusting.

Then again, there's also downtrodden pieces of chewing gum all over, and pieces of garbage everywhere but the bins, so not only the nicotine slaves are messy. They do contribute to quite a lot of the mess, though.



My father had a job back in the 1940's as spittoon cleaner. It was his job to clean the nasty things at some hotel. My father has never smoked even though his parents and brother smoked like chimneys. His brother both a smoker and drinker died of cancer at 68, my dad is still hail and hearty at 89.

"I dream of a better tomorrow, where chickens can cross the road and not be questioned about their motives." - Unknown
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Old 30th Dec 2018, 2:46 AM #39
SuicidiaParasidia
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gargoyle Cat
I wish people that drank kept it to themselves, but they don't. Two dear friends of mine were killed by a drunk driver. I told them I loved them one day, they were gone the following day. The drunk lost his license for a year, whoop-dee-do.


Responsible drinkers do. Unfortunately, there are always irresponsible drinkers. That's where legislation is supposed to step in: Where people can't be trusted to "act right" by their own merits, the law is there to fill the holes.
For the record, I'm all for drunk drivers being much more severely penalized. Regardless of whether or not there was an accident with casualties, there's zero excuse for anyone to be drunk behind the wheel in this day and age. Zero.
A large part of me is suspicious of people who try to excuse this sort of thing as an "everybody does it" sort of deal...

Quote:
Originally Posted by simmer22
Marginally better, since it mostly just damages their own health, but it's gross and makes a lot of mess if people don't dispose of it properly.

But a lot of smokers are also pigs, and apparently there's no such thing as a cigarette tray. There's stumps all over the city, particularly in bus shelters and around entryways. It's disgusting.

Then again, there's also downtrodden pieces of chewing gum all over, and pieces of garbage everywhere but the bins, so not only the nicotine slaves are messy. They do contribute to quite a lot of the mess, though.

I don't mind if someone decides they want to smoke and ruin their health. Their choice, that's fine. What I DO mind is when they decide to do it next to me, next to other people who don't like the smoke, next to kids, while pregnant, or in any other way so that it is potentially harmful for another person, in the short or long term. But ouside, alone, in the rain? Sure.


A lot of people are, unfortunately, pigs (I've seen cigarette butts, booze bottles, as well as chip bags, various boxes and any kind of party favor you can think of on the streets/in the park). Even those who don't have any vices leave litter, but I think that's the sort of problem that gets solved through upbringing efficiently. My parents taught me that if there's no garbage can around, you hold onto your trash until there is one. It's amazing how many people think the world is their garbage can.
OT, the positive about snuff as far as litter goes is that animals are possibly less likely to ingest it. Cigarette butts resemble our discarded food, so many scavenging bird species eat them and die.

Quote:
Originally Posted by HarVee
So do you have a choice over if you breathe oxygen or not?


I have a choice whether the oxygen I breathe is laced with cigarette smoke or not, same as you have a choice as to whether what you're drinking is laced with anything or not. What was the point of this question?

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Old 30th Dec 2018, 4:04 AM #40
simmer22
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Quote:
My parents taught me that if there's no garbage can around, you hold onto your trash until there is one.


It's amazing how many parents don't teach their kids this, and some parents are even worse than their kids.

I always use trash bins. I'd feel bad even leaving an apple core in the woods (even if it probably would do more good there than on a dump). I mostly keep to the city scape, so there's usually a few trash bins along the sidewalks, at shops, and even some in the bus, so there's usally somewhere to throw it away. If there isn't, I hold on to it until I do find a trash bin, even if I have to take it home with me. Seriously - how hard can it be? What irks me the most is when I see litter scattered around a trash bin. It's like the person was all "eh, it'll probably climb up on its own". Cause like everyone knows, litter does come to life and disposes of itself when you're not looking ( ).

Then you've got those idiots who leave improperly put-out cigarete snipes and similar fire hazards in the woods or elsewhere, potentially causing fires. Is it so hard to bring something like a disposable cup as a makeshift ash tray, drown the snipes in water, and when properly put out throw it in the nearest trash bin?
Last edited by simmer22 : 30th Dec 2018 at 4:14 AM.
Old 30th Dec 2018, 9:42 AM #41
Gargoyle Cat
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SuicidiaParasidia
Responsible drinkers do. Unfortunately, there are always irresponsible drinkers. That's where legislation is supposed to step in: Where people can't be trusted to "act right" by their own merits, the law is there to fill the holes.
For the record, I'm all for drunk drivers being much more severely penalized. Regardless of whether or not there was an accident with casualties, there's zero excuse for anyone to be drunk behind the wheel in this day and age. Zero.
A large part of me is suspicious of people who try to excuse this sort of thing as an "everybody does it" sort of deal...



There are laws on the books. People that commit homicide are supposed go to prison, they don't. Ever listen to somebody that has killed another person talk about how their rights are being violated because they are losing something? They are so blind to their own 'cause' that they always seem to forget that those that died because of them lost everything. There are no words to explain how infuriating that is. Nowhere in the US Constitution or in the Bill of Rights does it say that drunk drivers shall be given a pass, but yet, this is how these stories play out. The person that killed others is always the victim, never the cause.

Ted Kennedy, a US Senator killed a person because of his drunk driving. He never lost his job, much less spending a day in prison or in a rehab and yet generation after generation there are people that idolize the man and talk about how noble he was. Murder = noble. Perhaps this is why drunk driving continues to be a problem today...

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Old 2nd Jan 2019, 6:39 PM #42
pikeman101
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HarVee
Your country sounds like a depressing shithole where freedom doesn't exist. And I'm not saying no offense for that, because I meant it.

Your rights end where the rights of others start. If your smoking hurts others, it is perfectly reasonable to prevent you from smoking around them.
Old 5th Jan 2019, 7:29 AM #43
Jezzie
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HarVee
It's quite contradictory to try to make a statement about your country being accepting of different lifestyles when that country wants to ban people from partaking in one of their lifestyle choices (smoking).


I certainly wouldn't classify smoking as a lifestyle choice, a habit at best and at worst an addiction. True lifestyle choices do not have an impact on those who do not choose to be involved.

Quote:
Originally Posted by HarVee
Your country sounds like a depressing shithole where freedom doesn't exist. And I'm not saying no offense for that, because I meant it.


Just a few smoking laws in the 'shithole' where I live - you are not permitted to smoke in any public space, at all ever, unless you are in an open area such as a parking lot at least 10 metres from anyone. (Our Department of Health is working on banning ANY and ALL smoking in public so this 'freedom' could be removed all together, and you would only be permitted to smoke in your own home.) You are not permitted to smoke in any car if children are present, you are not permitted to smoke near children at all. In the near future, removal of all cigarettes or tobacco products from public view in shops. Removal of all branding on cigarette packets. All this applies to those fake e-cigarette thingys as well. That's all I can remember at this moment.

As the mother of twins who suffered with chronic asthma and an elderly mother with COPD, (my dad was a heavy smoker, so...???) and a beloved uncle who died of emphysema and a good friend who has had multiple heart attacks but still would rather die than give up smoking, I say bring it on!!

The laws in place in my country and the huge sin tax on tabacco products must be working because the number of smokers has dropped dramatically over the last few years which is a hugely positive thing. There are laws in place to punish those who drink and drive because of the danger they pose to others, so why not smokers when it has been proved over and over again that second hand smoke is detrimental to others?

Freedom should be extended to everyone, a 'depressing shithole' IMO would be somewhere where one persons right to 'freedom' (and I use that term loosely) negatively impacts the health of others. The health, well being and safety of others has to be more important, so you are free to smoke but then you have to do so with in the laws put place that protect those around you. Its called consideration for others, so if you don't like stay home and puff away.
Old 6th Jan 2019, 9:56 AM #44
SuicidiaParasidia
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gargoyle Cat
There are laws on the books. People that commit homicide are supposed go to prison, they don't. Ever listen to somebody that has killed another person talk about how their rights are being violated because they are losing something? They are so blind to their own 'cause' that they always seem to forget that those that died because of them lost everything. There are no words to explain how infuriating that is. Nowhere in the US Constitution or in the Bill of Rights does it say that drunk drivers shall be given a pass, but yet, this is how these stories play out. The person that killed others is always the victim, never the cause.

Ted Kennedy, a US Senator killed a person because of his drunk driving. He never lost his job, much less spending a day in prison or in a rehab and yet generation after generation there are people that idolize the man and talk about how noble he was. Murder = noble. Perhaps this is why drunk driving continues to be a problem today...


I agree, and that's something else that needs work. I also disagree w/people paying their way out of consequences. I don't agree with plea deals or bail. Our justice system is seriously broken, and nobody wants to even begin to fix it... but that's a bit off topic.

On topic: The point of a law against smoking in public would not be to punish smokers. It would be to protect non-smokers.

"The more you know, the sadder you get."~ Stephen Colbert
"I'm not going to censor myself to comfort your ignorance." ~ Jon Stewart
Versigtig, ek's nog steeds fokken giftig
Old 9th Jan 2019, 10:14 AM #45
mithrak_nl
Inventor

Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 1,004


I think it is important to protect people from harmful smoke created by others (any harmful smoke, not just from tabacco).

So it makes sense to ban smoking in public places where a lot of people gather. This to prevent people not being able to avoid smoke from other people's cigarette's. Using a sign to show it is banned in that area. But a general smoking ban is not fair imo. Just like I don't think a general banning of drinking would be fair. There should still be the freedom of choice for the individual. Just not at the expense of others. So basically work environments should be smoke free with possibly a ventilated smoking area away from nonsmokers if the owners chose to.

An exception to this I think would be private commercial places that are allowed to serve alcohol. I think it should be the owner's choice whether they allow people to smoke in those establishments. So no mandatory smoke free zones. I think that this is not a problem, because there would automatically be a demand for smoke free competition. Especially nowadays.
Old 11th Jan 2019, 6:18 AM #46
HarVee
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Quote:
Originally Posted by simmer22
^ I'd like to have a choice in regards to breathing in oxygen with or without a large cloud of cigarette smoke. There's more than enough pollution going around already.

If you want to smoke, it's your choice. But you don't need to do it around people who don't want to inhale the smoke, particularly in areas where it's difficult to get away from the smoke.


Only place I agree is inside hospitals and schools. All else is just ridiculous, especially for out door places such as parks. If it's law for places to be smoke free areas, then it must also be law for all places to have a designated smoking area. Fair is fair. Said practice is already done in airports.

"Towards the end of any culture, you have the second or third generation that steps into the culture, which is so far from the origination, it's the impression of what's real, but it's not the full definition of what's real. It's just cheesy." - Lyle Owerko
Old 11th Jan 2019, 9:04 AM #47
Liz
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Join Date: Jul 2006
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I used to smoke. For a long time, actually, and people were too often surprised that when I did, I would take care to stand downwind of them or just straight up put the thing out or walk away if the smoke was blowing at others. I was always surprised that they were so surprised by a little common sense and courtesy. Of course, I was born back when dinosaurs roamed the earth, so I still remember people smoking at football games and -- no, seriously, y'all -- at the grocery store. That was crazy.

If "But I don't like it!" were reason enough to legislate the behaviour of others, none of us would ever be able to leave our homes for fear of brushing up against a snowflake, but I genuinely sympathise with those who experience the real discomfort and distress that cigarette smoke can create. Banning smoking in public outright is far too stringent to my mind, but restricting it to certain areas? Yeah, no problem. In your seat at a football game? Not cool. Designated area away from the crowd? Sounds fair to me.

Quote:
Originally Posted by suzanne70
I’m a smoker and I’m trying to quit and it is very hard. So is my mum and she’s a heavy smoker. I’m only saying this because of how expensive cigarettes are in Australia but I need to quit because I can’t afford to keep doing it.

@suzanne70 , If you're interested, I highly recommend one of the Easy Way to Stop Smoking books by Allen Carr. Feel free to hit me up via PM if you'd like, but I'll leave it at that. Pushy ex-smokers are the worst. >_<
Old 15th Jan 2019, 1:52 AM #48
MonMon
Test Subject

Join Date: Dec 2017
Posts: 6


At this day and age I think ANYONE who pollutes the air is equally egoistical, if you smoke or still drive veicheles who runs on gas or diesel.
Old 15th Jan 2019, 2:16 AM #49
simmer22
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Join Date: Mar 2006
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^ Well, sort of - but if you already have an efficient diesel/gas car and decide to switch it out for an electrical car, you should know that the electrical one causes a LOT of pollution in the creation process, so unless you absolutely need a new car it may be fine to wait. Basically, if you need a new car, you may want go for the electrical one. If you don't need a new car, wait until you actually do need to switch it.

Breathing is a form of pollution in itself (CO2 gas), so technically it's difficult to entirely stop polluting. But having more green around (as in, not chopping down large amount of trees for yet another shopping mall with a huge parking lot) may be helpful. And you can do those little things like composting, recycling, biking/walking instead of driving, throwing away less food and trash, don't switch out electronics for the "newer model" if the one you have still works fine, don't buy new clothes every week, and so on. That, and of course not smoking. May not be much in the long run if you're doing this on your own, but if everyone could consume less, and production could go down a bit, the amount of pollution might also go down.
Old 15th Jan 2019, 2:55 AM #50
MonMon
Test Subject

Join Date: Dec 2017
Posts: 6


I do not drive, smoke or eat meat. They are all reasons why the air is polluted. However, i do think that blamming the smokers only isnt fair
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