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Old Yesterday, 9:52 PM #5326
mdsb759
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Most of the non-Townie/non-NPC pre-made Veronaville characters are from Shakespeare plays. Among playable characters, I think Consort is the only exception. Among characters that have a grave, I think Contessa is the only exception. Non-grave; a number of Titania's & Oberon's ancestors are some of those exceptions.
Last edited by mdsb759 : Today at 12:00 AM.
Old Yesterday, 10:49 PM #5327
AndrewGloria
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Consort doesn't have a grave at the start of the game. That's because he's still very much alive!! I tend to equate him with Lord Capulet in the play. (But then I've never seen or read Romeo and Juliet, only the children's story version by Charles and Mary Lamb. (Far from lying down and dying, in my game Consort is going to get married!)
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Old Yesterday, 10:55 PM #5328
mdsb759
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it seems you missed the words that came before his name; "among playable characters".
and also the words that came after the word "grave"; "I think Contessa..."
Old Yesterday, 11:28 PM #5329
AndrewGloria
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Sorry mdsb759! I misunderstood your punctuation. But (and I hope I'm not being too pedantic) capital letters at the start of sentences really do help with reading comprehension. I believe you're not a native English speaker, and it can't be easy for you, but the half second or so it takes to hold down the Shift Key when you type the first letter of a sentence really does help readers to understand your posts.

No offence intended, and I hope none is taken!

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Old Yesterday, 11:29 PM #5330
Rosebine
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Though good job using ;

Je mange des girafes et je parle aussi franšais !...surtout :0)
Old Yesterday, 11:38 PM #5331
Orphalesion
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mdsb759
most of the non-Townie/non-NPC pre-made Veronaville characters are from Shakespeare plays. among playable characters, I think Consort is the only exception; among characters that have a grave, I think Contessa is the only exception. non-grave; a number of Titania's & Oberon's ancestors are some of those exceptions.


Consort and Contessa are, arguably,not exceptions at all; Lord and Lady Capulet didn't have first names in Romeo and Juliet Contessa is just the rough Italian equivalent of "Lady"/"Countess" so she's really just Countess Capp -> Lady Capulet. Consort meanwhile often describes the spouse of a ruler, so he's "the husband of Countess Capp" -> Lord Capulet.
They literally are Lord and Lady Capulet.

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Old Today, 12:58 AM #5332
EmeraldFalcon
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And here I thought that "Consort" was a reference to the insult Tybalt uses on Romeo and Mercutio that escalated the fight that caused Mercutio and Tybalt's deaths.

Tybalt basically calls Romeo and Mercutio a couple, and Mercutio is so offended that refuses to listen to Romeo and fights Tybalt, defying the prince's order.

Part of the reason I buy into Veronaville headcannons that Consort is in the closet.

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Old Today, 3:49 AM #5333
Rosawyn
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EmeraldFalcon
Tybalt basically calls Romeo and Mercutio a couple, and Mercutio is so offended that refuses to listen to Romeo and fights Tybalt, defying the prince's order.

Yeah, I mean, translated into modern English, it basically goes like this:

Tybalt: lawl, gay!
Mercutio: Gay? Look, buddy, I might be as queer as a three dollar bill, but even if Romeo wasn't straight, he's really not my type! ...but you are!
*they fight*
Old Today, 5:39 AM #5334
conversesneaker
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EmeraldFalcon
And here I thought that "Consort" was a reference to the insult Tybalt uses on Romeo and Mercutio that escalated the fight that caused Mercutio and Tybalt's deaths.

Tybalt basically calls Romeo and Mercutio a couple, and Mercutio is so offended that refuses to listen to Romeo and fights Tybalt, defying the prince's order.

Part of the reason I buy into Veronaville headcannons that Consort is in the closet.


You might want to brush up your Shakespeare...Mercutio doesn't draw his weapon until after Romeo refuses to respond to Tybalt's insults of "villain" and "boy" (although yes, he does mock Tybalt's use of the word 'consort' - "Zounds, consort!" - that's before Romeo's entrance. Yes, I love Shakespeare )


Honestly, I just think it was a lost opportunity that they didn't name Consort, "Lear". It was right there! But then, these are the same game developers who named a child "Bottom".
Old Today, 8:18 AM #5335
Sketching
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Quote:
Originally Posted by conversesneaker
Honestly, I just think it was a lost opportunity that they didn't name Consort, "Lear". It was right there! But then, these are the same game developers who named a child "Bottom".

I guess there are characters who serve a dual purpose of sorts. The Puck-Hermia-Mercutio-Miranda tangle could be an attempt at Lysander-Hermia-Demetrius-Helena, among others. I usually imagine Consort as Lear instead though, albeit tweaked considering the Capps' matriarchal nature, and I think it's somewhat of a shame that there aren't more playable households or sims that are more representative of other Shakespearean (edit: spelling) characters, such as Macbeth and Hamlet. Adding a Lady Macbeth into the premade mix would've been interesting.

I like the thought put into some aspects of the hood, like Titania's character, the Summerdream house resembling Globe Theatre, and Juliette being stationed at the balcony when you first load the Summerdream house, but at the same time, I question The Bottom, where that strange hole in the middle of the Monty ranch leads to, and why in the world most of the houses are probably meant to fit pixies, not full-sized humans. The fae must've been in charge of architecture.

My life is a series of incomprehensible sketches, illegible notes, and running away from angry reptiles. I don't enjoy that last one.
Last edited by Sketching : Today at 11:52 AM. Reason: spelling
Old Today, 9:02 AM #5336
ihatemandatoryregister
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The architecture in Veronaville is some of the weirdest I've seen. Veronaville Market looks like someone gave up building it halfway through.

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Old Today, 9:18 AM #5337
Sketching
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Star carpet in the Capp Manor, Moroccan furniture in an Italian ranch, giant yards and cramped houses... When I just edited the lots for plopping down back then, I was dismayed that the houses flooded, so I had to settle for an edited empty version of Veronaville and redid just about everything, including that market. Goneril's bunch can barely afford anything as they're shipped in-game too.

My life is a series of incomprehensible sketches, illegible notes, and running away from angry reptiles. I don't enjoy that last one.
Old Today, 9:24 AM #5338
MasterRed
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Veronavilles great! I really wish the clean subhood worked on my computer because it's probably the second best premade hood after Strangetown. I had to do Romeo and Juliet in school, and that play is amazing and I've been wanting to play Veronaville ever since then, but sadly I don't think it was meant to be...
Old Today, 11:38 AM #5339
RoxEllen1965
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sketching
... at the same time, I question The Bottom, where that strange hole in the middle of the Monty ranch leads to, and why in the world most of the houses are probably meant to fit pixies, not full-sized humans. The fae must've been in charge of architecture.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ihatemandatoryregister
The architecture in Veronaville is some of the weirdest I've seen. Veronaville Market looks like someone gave up building it halfway through.


I decided to replace the "well" at the Monty ranch with the small fountain that came with University. It's a compatible style and looks much better, but I'll probably have to watch the sims closely to keep them from obsessing over putting soap in the damned thing. Maxis might very well have placed a fountain there themselves if the base game had included any. I think one of the biggest sources of problems with base game houses is that the Build Mode tools were so limited until a couple of expansion packs were added to it.

I always thought the Veronaville Market was meant to be a barn with a sort of farmer's market in it. I've seen pictures of antique barns that look a bit like that and it would explain the unfinished look and feel to the upstairs "hayloft."

Real houses that old would be very small by modern standards. Ordinary people (as opposed to royalty, wealthy merchant families, etc.) didn't need as much space since they didn't have as much junk as we modern folks do. Unfortunately, sims aren't real people and have more trouble routing through small living spaces than we would.

I always change Bottom's name to something else (usually "Mab") and treat "Bottom" as a nickname. Either she was really un-coordinated when learning to walk as a toddler and landed on her butt a lot, or she's a brat and her "bottom" has gotten smacked enough times to earn the nickname.
Old Today, 12:42 PM #5340
AndrewGloria
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ihate, Veronaville Market isn't a modern building that's never been finished. It's an old historic building that has seen many changes over the hundreds of years that it's stood there. The streets of Veronaville are redolent with history, and nowhere is that truer than Veronaville Market. Merchant Sims have been buying and selling goods on that site since the early middle ages. The "modern" building dates from the late 16th century (probably built between 1550 and 1580). Obviously there have been changes over that period -- Tudor merchants didn't have chill cabinets of freezers! They didn't even have running water.

Something has obviously happened to the upper stories of the building. Andrew, who lives across the road at 19 Chorus Court and is doing Veronaville Market as a school history project, is trying to find out what happened. One possibility is obviously fire. Another is death-watch beetle. Whatever it was, there was obviously originally more than the modern overhead walkway. Veronaville Market is not just a place to do your shopping. It's a place where you can sit and ponder the lives of Sims who traded there in past centuries.

I find it easy to understand the extreme attachment that Veronaville Sims have to their town. It's a beautiful place with a fascinating heritage.

I am minded to start a thread on "Historic Buildings of Old Veronaville".

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Old Today, 1:49 PM #5341
conversesneaker
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RoxEllen1965
I always change Bottom's name to something else (usually "Mab") and treat "Bottom" as a nickname. Either she was really un-coordinated when learning to walk as a toddler and landed on her butt a lot, or she's a brat and her "bottom" has gotten smacked enough times to earn the nickname.


It is textually supported that Bottom is a brat! I think it is Puck's bio that describes her as "a bratty sister".


And for all our love/hate of Veronaville, I'll do well to remember that I'm in debt to Veronaville for being my first source of Shakespeare (forgetting an episode of Wishbone and other subtle pop culture references) - since Veronaville was the first Sims 2 hood I played, it helped lead the way to my later love of Shakespeare's plays!


Quote:
Originally Posted by AndrewGloria
I find it easy to understand the extreme attachment that Veronaville Sims have to their town. It's a beautiful place with a fascinating heritage.

I am minded to start a thread on "Historic Buildings of Old Veronaville".


Do it!
Old Today, 4:04 PM #5342
Orphalesion
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Personally Veronaville is my least favourite neighbourhood of all Sims neighbourhoods that shipped with the basegame or expansions.

I love the Monty villas and have cleaned versions of them in my current hood (Malcolm Landgraab III lives in one of them) but the Tudor style of the Capp side of town is something I find excruciatingly ugly to look at (it simply goes against my personal aesthetic) and a lot of them are rather impractical.

The Romeo and Juliet parallel is also something I don't really care for, since, imho, it's both not very well done and way too obvious and unimaginative.
If they had done it more like either Westside Story or Romeo+Juliet, properly update everything and throw in a few modern twists I would have liked it better.

And they also left out so many characters that could have given the town more than the 3 family lines it starts with: The Prince (he could have been the mayor!) the Nurse, the Friars, the servants.

And why have the Fairies from Midsummer Night's Dream and Hermia, but not the other 3 youths?

They could have all been less important families aligned with the Monties/Capps

But no, instead we got heaps of Capps and Monties with the names of Shakespear characters slapped onto them at (mostly) random. They could have been more clever with it.

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Old Today, 6:57 PM #5343
Annorah
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AndrewGloria, I thought no one could love Veronaville more than I do, but here you are.
Old Today, 8:05 PM #5344
RoxEllen1965
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The characters in Veronaville are inspired by Shakespeare's plays. They're not meant to be direct exact copies of the characters in those plays. They're set up so that you can mostly choose to do what you want with them. If you want to play out "Romeo and Juliet" (or "King Lear" or "Midsummer Night's Dream" etc.), you can. If you don't want to bother with any of that, you don't have to.

Really my only complaint about Veronaville was the lack of expandability until NL and then OFB. Most of the pre-placed houses are much too expensive for new characters to move into and there isn't much room to add new affordable housing.
Old Today, 8:42 PM #5345
MasterRed
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I barely remember Veronaville so I'm biased, but it's in my top list of neighbourhoods just because I get to give Romeo and Juliet a happy ending. And I'm terrible at building hoods so I just love all pre made hoods far too much and that's probably affecting my opinion.
Old Today, 9:14 PM #5346
Rosawyn
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Orphalesion
But no, instead we got heaps of Capps and Monties with the names of Shakespear characters slapped onto them at (mostly) random. They could have been more clever with it.

I honestly can't get past Beatrice and Benedick being siblings. As a long-time fan of "Much Ado About Nothing," seeing that squicked me so much I had to just exit out of the hood. I've never actually tried to play it.
Old Today, 9:19 PM #5347
ihatemandatoryregister
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I turned Veronaville into vampires (Capps) vs werewolves (Montys). The Summerdreams are witches. Makes things a bit more interesting.

I'm secretly a Bulbasaur.

My memory is poor, so please take anything I say with a grain of salt. | Looking for SimWardrobe's mods? | Or Dizzy's? | Faiuwle/rufio's too! | smorbie1's Chris Hatch archives
Old Today, 10:14 PM #5348
Annorah
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ihatemandatoryregister
I turned Veronaville into vampires (Capps) vs werewolves (Montys). The Summerdreams are witches. Makes things a bit more interesting.


. . . You. . . Genius.

I will be back.
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